In this episode of The Mailbox Money Show, Bronson leads a panel from the 2025 Alternative Assets Summit on how investors can properly evaluate risk and build resilient, diversified portfolios.
Joined by Ryan Gibson, Kaaren Hall, and Patrick Grimes, the discussion covers risk-adjusted returns, operator quality, due diligence, and portfolio allocation across alternative investments. The panel shares real-world lessons on avoiding fraud, managing uncertainty, and balancing cash flow versus appreciation across different life stages.
The episode wraps with practical frameworks for assessing sponsors, using AI tools for smarter analysis, and building portfolios designed to perform across market cycles—not just in good times.
Bronson Hill: This event, like I mentioned, is the 2025 Alternative Assets Summit. My name is Bronson Hill. If we have not met, we do educational events like this every month where you have a podcast called the Mailbox Money Show.
And really, our focus is alternative assets, so we give opportunities to invest in things like oil and gas, and self-storage, and different real estate, or buying private businesses. And we just love having conversations around what it means to be an investor, what are the pros and cons, the pitfalls. And I found some of the best things we can do is get in a room like this and really get smart people together having a dialogue about these topics.
So we’ve got some new things in the news now we’re going to talk about. We’re going to have a chance for you guys to ask questions as well. And we’re also going to basically have this, I always get this question, but this is going to be recorded.
This is being recorded. So if you have to book out a little early, hopefully you can stay for the whole thing. But if you have to book out early, it will be sent to you as a replay.
Also on our YouTube channel, we have all of our replays of all these events.
So it’s going to be awesome. Really excited to have you here.
I’m going to go ahead and welcome up our panelists and we’re going to get started. I’ll go ahead and welcome them up and give them an intro. So go ahead and move to the webinar, guys, and we’ll get you going.
I believe Courtney Moeller was planning. She was planning to be here and she had some technical issues. I’m not sure if she is going to be able to make it.
And so if you are here, Courtney, just put your name in the chat there. We’ll have you come up. But sometimes I’m not sure if you’re going to be able to be there.
So give a quick intro here. So in the house today, super excited. We have a bunch of good friends here.
Just really feels like just having a great almost like a family dinner. I just have some just awesome people together. Just good, good friends of mine.
I’ve done deals with a couple of you guys and then worked with Karen as well. So give a quick intro.
Patrick Grimes from Passive Investing Mastery.
What’s going on, Patrick?
Patrick Grimes: Glad to be here, Bronson. Thanks for having me.
Bronson Hill: He just got off stage in person. He was on stage in a place in Hawaii where he lives and he just ran over here. And that’s why it looks like you’re not even sweating anymore.
You just it’s not even breaking a cold sweat. There you go. Family office club.
Love it. Love it. Love it. Great. OK.
And then we’ve got Karen Hall with you direct Ira services. How’s it going, Karen?
Kaaren Hall: It is going great. Just, you know, self directing these IRAs are not going to direct themselves.
So I’ve got to do it. Yeah, that’s what I’m here for.
Bronson Hill: So they’re self directed, but you have to direct them yourself. They don’t do it themselves.
Kaaren Hall: You know, there’s a joke in there somewhere. So thanks. Thanks for trying to save me.
Bronson Hill: Awesome. Well, thank you for being here. Thanks for sharing that.
Karen is also a member of our Wealth For Elite Group, which is our in-person group. We gather investors in person once a quarter and we do virtual meetings to share deals and information. It’s just been phenomenal.
We’ve been doing that for over a year now. It’s been great. So so excited to have you, Karen.
And then we’ve got Ryan Gibson of Seattle Area Spartan Investment Group. Ryan, how’s it going, brother?
Ryan Gibson: Good. I’m the most boring person in the room, but, you know, I’ll just say my wife says that, what makes me interesting is that I was an airline pilot before I was a full time self storage investor.
So there you go.
Now that makes me interesting.
Bronson Hill: That is interesting. I think you guys are all very interesting and have a story to tell. So super excited. We’ve got a lot to talk about here.
We’re going to jump right into it. First of all, let’s talk about the big, beautiful bill, right? We just had the big, beautiful bill.
And there’s some changes. One hundred percent depreciation is back in a lot of our investors, especially real estate investors. I’m like, man, where’s the depreciation?
Where’s the tax benefits? What’s going on here? And now it’s back.
Is anybody else want to comment on depreciation, kind of how that’s changing? Actually, maybe let’s start.
Let’s kind of just work down the line and just see how you see this impacting your business.
We’ll start with Ryan on this.
Ryan Gibson: You know, they say that it’s for billionaires, but it’s not because it’s permanently putting people on a tax bracket that is lower than the Tax and Jobs Cut Act of 2017. So it’s putting a permanent tax cut in place for people who make less than two hundred thousand dollars a year. Now you can do tip deductions of up to twenty five thousand dollars a year.
That phases out. This is a lot of these are phase outs, right? So you phase out at three hundred thousand as a married couple, it might be four hundred thousand.
Deductions for seniors, you get an additional twelve thousand dollar bonus deduction for seniors over sixty five overtime tips. You can deduct it to twenty five thousand.
That’s overtime and tips. So you’re not just doing the tip thing. It’s overtime as well.
They’re taking out green energy credits. They’re increasing the child tax credit to twenty two hundred dollars per child. Now you can deduct your car loan interest.
So long as it’s assembled in the United States, that phases out above three hundred two hundred thousand for married couples. Then you get this one time child tax credit for a thousand dollars for children born between twenty twenty five and twenty twenty eight. Although they call it Trump accounts, just so you have to say his name in that.
And then charitable deductions go to two thousand, right?
So state and local deduction. This is like your salt. This is, for the people that live on the coast, they have their higher property taxes, state and local taxes. You can now deduct up to forty thousand dollars before it was ten thousand dollars.
Now it’s forty thousand dollars. And then the gift tax exemptions raised to thirty million. So when you hear in the news that this is for billionaires, this is for people that are making less than three hundred or four hundred thousand dollars as a married filing joint.
So what this means to me as a real estate investor, it means that my customers are going to have more money in their pocket. And that’s what this means. Right.
Now, there’s Medicare or Medicaid cuts nine hundred and eighty billion, but those aren’t going to go into effect until after the midterms. Which, surprise, surprise, a lot of elections coming up. So that that was pretty strategic, I think.
But I think all the real estate people in the room know and probably have been hearing in social media all over the place from every single Cossack provider that one hundred percent bonus appreciation is back.
And of course, anything purchased after January 19th, 2025. We all know what happened on January 20th, twenty twenty five. Trump got elected.
So anything after his inauguration date or later that you buy. But what’s super interesting about that is if you started building a construction project prior to that date, depending on how much construction was actually commensurated prior to that date. You still might be able to bonus appreciate. For example, we’re building self-storage facilities right now that might not deliver to later this year, but the land was bought last year.
And so you still qualify for bonus depreciation on some of the construction expenditures that happened past that January 19th date. So check with your CPA. You still can take advantage of some projects that started before that date and take advantage of bonus depreciation.
So needless to say, bonus depreciation is back. That’s going to mean that money potentially, more money could be invested in real estate. Our tenants are going to have more money in their pocket with more deductions.
And I think this is good overall for the economy. Doesn’t do a lot for our national deficit. If you’re a hardcore fiscal conservative like myself, I would say that this bill falls short of cutting the deficit to the extent we need to.
But this is just a bill that was meant to cut a lot of our discretionary spending. This was kind of mandatory stuff. So we’re going to see more tax conversations come up later in the year as they introduce subsequent bills that kind of eliminate more of our discretionary spending potentially.
So overall, I’m a fan. One more thing. One more thing I wanted out of their standard deduction raised from 30,000 to 31,500.
So you don’t have to itemize as much to get a standard deduction. So overall, I think this is a net benefit. I’m excited.
Bronson Hill: Awesome. I appreciate that. Yeah, it almost feels like there’s a lot of benefits here, both as an investor, people will have more money and also it drives more investment into real estate.
So if you’re a real estate investor, that’s those are those are very positive things.
Patrick Grimes, anything else to add to that? That was a lot of great information there.
Patrick Grimes: I went through a pretty exhaustive list. There’s probably one that comes from a machine design automation robotics background, like a lot of the high tech investors in our network are going to benefit from the R&D tax credits being reinstated, too. That’s another component.
And when I was a robotics engineer and became an S corp contractor, I was not only able to find myself a W two, but I was able to take advantage of those tax credits. And it’s really great to see that reinvestment into R&D. So companies are now going to have a significant tax break that they used to.
And it had been mostly phased out. And so that is what Ryan saying all of that stimulates the economy, right? Let’s hope that it’s not at the expense of the solvency of the United States of America and the deficit with some of the world’s largest economies betting against the dollar right now.
But at the same time, if it can help outpace, some of the growth of our competitors, then it is what it is. The votes been cast and that bill has been passed. But it’s appreciation.
Awesome. And of course, in our acquisition strategies, we’re going to take advantage of that.
Bronson Hill: Absolutely. Yeah, it is. I think there’s a lot of positives from that.
I’m glad they finally passed. They talked about it for the last couple of years. Remember, we’re looking for K ones and we were delayed and they were delayed.
And so then have actually this back for real estate investors is super positive. Karen, what did you anything you’ve seen from the big, beautiful bill that affects investors that maybe hasn’t been shared yet?
Kaaren Hall: Yeah, I mean, as far as congressional acts have impacted, retirement savers, we had secure 1.0 and 2.0 over the last few years. So that there’s been a lot of activity in the space in the past year. So this isn’t really a huge for retirement.
One thing it does impact, though, is the HSA. You can self direct a health savings account. So if you have a high deductible health plan where you work, then you have this health savings account that’s adjacent to it.
Those dollars, it’s like the best thing ever. It’s like, it’s like even better than a Roth because the money goes in, you get a tax break, grows tax free, comes out tax free. But what the bill, what this a new bill did is it increased the contribution limits.
It used to be a family contribution. Now it’s husband and wife, each with a contribution. So it really does.
There’s some impact there in the self-directed IRA space. But otherwise, another tremendous move. But again, with secure act 2.0, the most recent thing to come out, we had a really big event, which was being able to make Roth contributions to SEP IRAs.
Did you guys even know that? And that you can contribute possibly as high as $70,000 to a SEP IRA as Roth contribution. So that is the most recent thing to come out in our space.
But this bill does really, this new bill does impact the HSA contributions.
Bronson Hill: I just want to give a shout out to Karen. She was recently interviewed by Rich Sommers, who’s a real estate guy in San Diego. And they’ve had almost, there were two Instagram reels that got almost 4 million views total.
So she did a little story on it. If you want to see that or click the link on there, it’s pretty impressive. And we’ll have you tell that story.
I want you to tell that story. And actually, if you just tell that story real quick of what like went and so viral on that, just tell that story.
Kaaren Hall: Oh, everyone’s going to love this. So this is where I used, where I worked before at a self-directed IRA company before you direct, and there was a young man who opened a Roth IRA, used his Roth dollars to buy tickets to the Super Bowl and sold those tickets at a profit. So the IRA, the Roth acquired the asset, the tickets, and he didn’t keep them very long.
He turned them around. He sold them. People do that all the time, the tickets and assets.
So sold the ticket and the profit went back into his Roth IRA tax free for life. And there have been just hundreds and maybe even thousands of comments about that. So I wrote an article that’s in there, you know, why it wasn’t impacted by Yubit, why it’s not a prohibited transaction.
And so on and on. So everything you want to do to criticize that little, that little thing, you can do it. Now, the one thing I did say on the initial podcast was that a ticket was real estate.
And I think because I was thinking a ticket, a ticket’s a lease. But I was in this like real estate class and this, they were teaching us and the instructor told me that a ticket to a ballgame was actually real estate because you had a lease on that seat. That was his, but I break it down in the article.
So if you want to see it, it’s all broken down there.
Bronson Hill: There’s a question here. What’s the conversion rate on that many reels? So you can type that in the chat.
I know at least just the more business that’s what we’re all wondering. Well, don’t forget about the little people now that you’re famous there Kaaren and appreciate it.
So I think and I say that just to kind of pause for a second.
I think for a lot of us, a lot of people have money in retirement accounts. I’m sure Patrick and Ryan, you’ve seen this too. People have lots of money and they think they can’t use it.
And even sometimes their employer will say, oh, you can’t use it. When I was doing medical sales, I was working for different companies and I had to wait till I left the company to go to another company. But then I finally approached HR and I basically made the case and they actually let me roll over some of it.
It was kind of a vesting period. You could roll some of it over, but I’ve heard people just like go and they get referred to like some investment advisor person that’s not even really their company. And they say, oh, you can’t transfer it over.
But those people want to keep the money and the assets under manager. They don’t want to have it go out. So we’re always trying to find ways to get money out of Wall Street and into Main Street, which is really what we’re doing.
So I want you guys, let’s go around now, especially I want to give time for Ryan, for Patrick and Karen. Just talk specifically about assets either in your business or things in Karen’s case, maybe things that you’ve seen that just are interesting.
Let’s talk about the kind of some of the business stuff you’re doing.
Ryan, I know you breathe and sleep self storage. So why don’t you just talk a little bit about some of the things that drew you to self storage and why you think it’s we just we’re at a tour in Houston together and it’s like it’s pretty pretty exciting.
You know what’s happening. So talk about what’s happening in self storage right now.
Ryan Gibson: You know, for me, for me, it all starts with a story of how I used it. Right. So I used to think self storage was kind of the silliest thing ever.
And I had a life event. I had two kids and we moved into our new house and pretty quickly we realized, you know, we did another bathroom. We needed to add onto the house.
We need to renovate our basement. We do all these things. And so I had to hire a contractor and we moved our stuff out of our house and moved into self storage.
And, you know, I was paying 100 bucks a month or whatever it was. And after about, I don’t know, maybe four or five months, I get a letter in the mail and it says your your rent is increased to one hundred and twenty dollars. And I was like a 20 percent increase.
And I’ve been there for, I don’t know, four or five months. This is crazy. And and I thought, what am I going to do?
I’m in the middle of a renovation. I’ve got all my stuff in the self storage unit. So I start calling around.
Everybody’s full. Nobody has any room. And what am I going to do?
So anyway, that got me intrigued in the space. And what I realized is it’s not a industry that for Americans with too much stuff. I mean, sure, we have a lot of stuff, but it’s really a space and a resource for people who are going through some kind of life event. You know, dying, divorcing, getting married, having kids, moving, changing jobs and really comes down to the four D’s death, displacement, downsizing and divorce.
And when I got into this space and started growing our portfolio, I realized 70 percent of your customers come from people just living. Right. And now they’re on every street corner.
So they’re a part of a staple and a move. And the other 30 percent are business owners, people that are having landscaping, sheet metal contractors that are, you know, need the space for their business. And and that’s why I think it’s played out.
If you look at the nary performance over the last 30 years, it is the number one performing asset class across all asset classes at 17 percent average annual return. Especially during times of disruption, you know, when there’s downsides in the market, there’s upsides in the market, it’s good. And actually right now, self storage is actually pretty flat right now because there really isn’t any disruption happening in America.
People aren’t losing their homes or jobs. People aren’t really expanding or growing or buying homes. So it’s kind of a good time because it’s sort of quiet and there isn’t a lot of crazy activity like there was during covid or even the last GFC.
So kind of an interesting asset class. That’s why we got into it. And now we have over almost six million square feet of self storage.
We’re one of the largest. We’re the 30th largest operator in the United States. And overall, it’s just been a great a great asset class to get into.
Bronson Hill: Love it. Thank you for sharing that, brother. Yeah.
And I think self storage, a lot of times boring invest, you know, investing is the best investing, right? It doesn’t have to be super flashy. And so besides the volatility of crypto, it’s performed better than anything else.
Awesome. Let’s go, Patrick. What I know you’re doing like me, you’re doing a lot of different things.
Why don’t you talk about just kind of high level, some of the things that you’re excited about in your business now?
Patrick Grimes: Well, I just got done talking on stage about non-correlated alternative investing strategies. And I think that the family offices are interested in it. And I’m at the family office retreat.
It’s probably relevant because right now I think we just got done with everybody knows about the pandemic and a Fed rate hike 11 out of the last 14 of the Fed rate hikes ended up in a bust. But that’s not it.
Two proxy wars. We’ve got a real war. We’re just bond Iran. Any of especially the energy sector can get hit, which drives inflation.
Any of those could cause a problem. In addition to that, you have some of the world’s biggest economies betting against the dollar. You have so many different things right now compounded by all of that in a trade war.
It’s just a list goes on and on about any one of these items could cause some market instability. And it makes sense to always be investing, not in the one trick pony. Not into all all in, into one specific market or asset class driven by one set of market fundamentals. And I know why because I lost everything in 2009 and 10 getting over eager and excited and speculative pre-development real estate.
And then the subprime mortgage collapse happened. What did I do? I mean, that was the biggest case of fraud in America’s history.
Right now is another time when you’ve got to think about non-correlated alternatives. And those are ones that don’t rise and fall with whatever else you have in your portfolio. And that’s why really you’re saying you’re saying either opportunistic investments like an income or acquisitions and commercial real estate, which is having a similar hit that single family did back in 9 and 10 commercial real estate.
You can lend high and you can buy low, some impressive times right now really opportunistic with certain strategies or in legal. We have I love litigation finance. Why?
Because the legal industry is just it does really well in great times and people get litigious and bad times and it does really well. Again, I mean, it just if you look at the graphs in our deck, it just doesn’t care just like education and just like health care. Other markets, CPA firms, plumbers, none of those call them recession resilient combined with the overlapping Venn diagram of non-correlation.
Those provide true resilience and allocations in these different markets and these different strategies help to balance your portfolio and downturns.
Bronson Hill: Like the honey badger just doesn’t care. Right. It just keeps going.
Patrick Grimes: Right.
Bronson Hill: I love that. Yeah, that’s true. I love that, man.
Well, thank you for sharing that. We’re call Kaaren in here in a second. I wanted to share real quick our three favorite cash flow investments right now.
I think one thing that the last few years have taught me is that cash flow is so, so important and making a lot of money someday is just not as important as having money now. And so I asked that question for the 2500 calls I have with investors cash flow or appreciation more important. I think cash flow is amazing because it reduces your basis as far as your risk.
You get money back sooner and it actually able to fire yourself. Right. Like my book says be able to leave your your J.O.B. So I love debt funds or private credit is a great place to be for cash flow. Oil and gas deals. There’s two types. One is that oil and gas drilling.
So we have deals that we’re doing that for the ordinary income tax reduction, which is really if you’re paying a lot in taxes and you can’t find a way to reduce it, maybe you’re like a professional or a doctor or something. There’s ways people can reduce incredible people like to produce a million dollars to zero.
Like it’s unbelievable.
And then also owning oil and gas mineral rights, right, when in the land itself, like that’s a pretty attractive thing because you have existing cash flow based here from day one in the deal. And the last one really is buying private businesses. Now that’s been a little bit.
It’s great in concept. It’s hard to actually close on a business, which we found out this last year, but we still love it. We still love the ability to be able to buy private businesses.
Kaaren Hall, what are you obviously you’ve seen a lot of things. You’ve seen a lot.
Actually, I want to talk to card. I’m like, tell me what some of the craziest things you’ve seen is like obviously this Super Bowl tickets. Now, if the guy’s tickets, he bought several tickets and they’d gone down and he decided to use them.
He would have taken a penalty on it, but he kind of gambled. It was a gamble for him, but he did it. What are some other things that you’ve seen right now that you think are really interesting as an investor?
Kaaren Hall: Well, you know, when people are investing their retirement dollars, they’re not always going all out and doing crazy things like Super Bowl tickets that that’s unusual. But people like to be conservative with their retirement dollars. And I’m sure that’s not very surprising.
What we’re seeing now, the number one asset class is cryptocurrency. We keep hearing about how this is, you know, Trump is all for it. And the digital dollar and where we very well may be going this way.
We’ve known that for quite some time. And of course, Bitcoin is finite, isn’t it? There’s only so much.
And so there is built in scarcity.
And so we’re seeing values go up in crypto and more and more. I think in the last week we had a manager meeting last week, it was like 250,000 in a week go out to crypto from our account holders.
And that’s from the idle cash they’re holding. That’s after they typically invested in something else. So lots and lots of cryptocurrency.
But the number one asset class for the industry is syndications. Now, this indication obviously isn’t an investment in itself. It just describes, obviously, the structure.
The underlying is self-storage. The underlying asset is apartment buildings or multifamily, which is apartment buildings or what else, mobile home parks and things like this. So in general, most of the time syndications are the number one asset class.
Now, cryptocurrency is sneaking in there. But notes, people can take their IRAs and be the bank and lend money to other people, secured and unsecured, and also by performing a non-performing debt. Now, non-performing debt was really big a little while ago.
So that’s also something that’s cyclical. But just to understand that in down times, when people aren’t paying their bills, that non-performing debt, you can buy pennies on the dollar with your account, your retirement account, your self-directed account, and then make the delta between what’s owed and what you bought it for. So it can be a really lucrative asset class.
So that’s what we’re seeing in the self-directed space right now.
Bronson Hill: I love that. Yeah, then I see a lot of things. It’s interesting, you know, I think several of us operate deals and Kaaren’s a little bit different because she works with the timing accounts or self-directed or other sorts of accounts, especially to see what everybody’s doing, right?
She’ll see like billions of dollars coming in and out. So it’s just it’s interesting to talk to people that are kind of outside because they have a lot more information. On that note, and I kind of prepped you guys before a little bit.
If you got something to share here, but we talked about this is sometimes when we’re operators, we just love, love, love what we’re doing. And we’re so excited about it. But I want to talk and have you share one thing that you’re excited about investing in or that you’re excited about that’s not related to your business at all.
And I’ll go first because I think it’s good that we share things that, you know, we’re doing personally, but are not just part of our business. I think sometimes we’ll feel like, oh, hey, well, obviously you like self storage because you’re in self storage or like private credit, you do it. But what is something that’s not related to your business at all?
So for me, one thing I’ve been doing for about four or five years is really getting into precious metals. And I think the reason why I love precious metals is because there’s no counterparty risk. You see central banks buying it all over the world.
It’s not obviously done very well, but it’s a great way to hedge inflation. And also I can, and I’ve talked about this a little before, but I can draw liquidity from it. So instead of keeping, you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars in the bank for liquidity, I can have it in precious metals in a third party vault and I can borrow against it like a HELOC at about a 10% valid, a 10% interest rate just for the days that I need it.
So I need to close a deal. I’ve got some liquidity to be able to do that. So that’s one investment that I’m pretty excited about right now, especially with all the creation, all the spending, all the stuff that’s happening.
It just seems like there’s more and more responsibility on the fiscal side. Let’s go to Patrick and we’ll come back to Ryan. What’s an investment that you are excited about unrelated to your business?
Patrick Grimes: Well, so right now I’m pasting in Patrick’s favorite alternative investments for wealth and, and, and stability because that’s the most common question I get asked. So we, our mastery series promotes completely, which all of you except for Ryan is beyond, Ryan and beyond soon. But we, every two weeks we promote completely different asset classes.
So we’ve got over 50 different, completely different asset classes. We have deep dove into. And so I’ve amalgamated my favorites and I put them in that Patrick’s favorite alternative investment strategies because there’s a bunch of them.
I mean, that’s my jam. I just love looking at different completely non-correlated novel alternatives. And I listed some of the ones that I think are the most pertinent.
I mean, certainly there’s allocations that make sense to have in some of the more volatile commodities like oil and gas. There’s allocations, of course, that makes sense to have in some long-term real estate acquisitions, equity plays. And as Karen was pointing out in debt, debt’s really, that’s why, that’s why we do both of those things.
Now, in certain strategies, not like the strategies of the old school value add stuff where you’re hoping rents will grow up and prices will go upright. We’re doing very different strategies to win from the downturn. But other more novel alternatives that are very relevant today are ones that are insulated from market volatility, ones that don’t rely on major market factors.
And so making allocations, and as I was mentioning earlier, like the legal industry or health care, health care, both medical practices as well as medical receivables are pretty common, right? There’s a lot of really solid investments in those spaces. Also in what I see is pretty common right now, people getting involved with CPA firms or plumbers, HVAC, these types of industries that are needed in downturns that are needed in good times and bad times.
Those are great allocations for people to focus on.
Bronson Hill: I love that. Thank you for sharing. Ryan, what about you?
Besides e-breathing and sleeping self storage, what do you enjoy?
Ryan Gibson: Yeah, you know, I always like to say like, you know, the 10 30, 30, 30 rule, right? So, you know, for a guy like me, I’m not interested in alternatives because I have a lot of alternative assets. I have a lot of non liquid, real estate, you know, 800 million plus in self storage.
So like, what’s on my agenda is not to do more alternatives. It’s probably to diversify a little bit more into the stock market, which I know is allergic to this call a little bit. But, you know, I like to have 10% of my cash in cash in cash equivalents, making sure that I have some liquidity and I’m at my portfolio that I like to do 30% managed money, stocks, bonds, mutual funds, things like that, 30% real estate, then 30% into alternatives.
So with that out of the way, I wouldn’t say, make sure your investment strategy is is right size to have to be able to be liquid. I see too many times people take all their money and they dp it all into alternatives and then they’re upset when they can’t get that cash back. And so I think just knowing that and kind of having that like platform, and kind of understanding where I’m coming from, I’ve been heavy into debt funds.
I’ve been heavy into private lending because those are things that have that are time based that have redemption that I can call back. I’ve also been diversifying more into the stock market and crypto and Bitcoin because those are things again that are that are somewhat relatively liquid. You know, I would say my lessons learned or, you know, as an investor running Spartan for the, you know, over a decade now is I like to invest in a quality institutional quality assets.
I am not a B and C moving up a letter grade kind of guy anymore. That is a fool’s errand. I think that people think that the B and C or the things that people go to during tough times and things like that.
I think what we all learned from at least the last go around with real estate is all that stuff got hit first and what and what stayed really the course of time and what investors really put a premi on our class a stabilized facilities, whether that’s multifamily, whether that’s even a nicer manufactured housing community, a nicer self storage facility. The big money is still putting big money into that type of assets. , but I’ve always been a big fan of mobile home parks, RV parks, self storage, multifamily.
I’m in all of these things, private credit, debt fund, things that come with a, you know, real estate backed or asset backed lending are all really good things. I would just encourage, you know, have a, have a complete portfolio and make sure you’ve got a way to shore up liquidity, you know, when you need it. And so that’s kind of what I’m focused on and where I put my money.
Bronson Hill: Yeah. The, , the piece of the, the, I really liked that was a lot about asset allocation as well. And I, one thing I was a registered investment advisor, which is known as an RA and I still call myself an RA, which is a recovering investment advisor.
But that was, that was the question that people just can’t, they can’t, you can’t answer for people, right? How do I allocate? How much, like, some people are like 50% in, in precious metals or like 80% in like high risk startups.
And it’s like, and they’re old, you know, it’s like, well, you should do that, but that’s what they want to do. So you have to kind of let them do it. But I think having some plan, reallocating, having, I think that’s, they say it’s one of the biggest things, figure out how to allocate, , Karen, , what do you, I mean, personally, what are some things you’re excited about?
Kaaren Hall: Yeah. I mean, I’ve invested in lots of different things. I mean, several syndications I’ve been a node investor personally, you know, and in fact, I had one really bad note that the guy who was the sponsor of this deal , ran off to a foreign country and stopped paying everybody.
So there’s a lawsuit and it looks like I might get most of the money back. So that’s pretty cool. It doesn’t always happen, but that’s one of the exciting stories about investing, you know, outside of my IRA.
But I also, like you Bronson, am a precious metals fan. , the folks over at Delaware depository call me a silver stacker because you get them in these little cases, you know, they’re all stacks of like the Liberty coins. Cause like you say, I mean, it’s, it’s U S minted coins.
, and they, it is a hedge against inflation and they also have, , industrial, , proud, you know, you see, even if you’re not, you know, you use it for fillings or for microchips or something like that. So it’s not just currency, cause I do have some bars and things like that. So I had industrial and currency, you know , facets to it.
And, of course, single family homes, I have some single family rentals because my background is real estate and mortgage loan servicing, loan origination. There’s just nothing like a single-family home.
You know, if it’s just good all the way around, it was a blast fixing them up, you know, going through the acquisition stage and negotiating and fixing them up and then having a nice family live there and, and hearing their fun stories, having them send me pictures of what’s going on. It’s just the whole cycle so far has been great. I mean, knock wood, I’ll have one of those stories that everybody else has, but I don’t have one of those stories yet.
, but I also enjoy the single family home space as well.
Bronson Hill: Yeah, that’s great. , I think it’s one of the reasons we do this as well as for you to get new ideas on how you to invest, you know, as a, as somebody who’s tuning in, obviously we’re going to do questions here in a few minutes or comments if people want to ask any questions to our panel here. But , one thing that I’ve noticed in alternatives is it can be really challenging to evaluate risk in a project, something that seems like a pretty basic run of the mill deal all of a sudden becomes a very high risk.
And I’ll be, we saw when interest rates rose very quickly. We had, for example, a multifamily deal that we put 20% down and we had debt on it. We thought, hey, we’re going to fix it up.
There’s some safety here in this because we’re fixing it up. And then when rates rose very quickly, no matter what kind of debt you had, the property value decreased by 40%. Right.
So no matter what you did in that property, you’re upside down. And so, you know, there were some real challenges, real pain for a lot of people. I know a lot of investors probably here in this room watching this live or on the replay as well.
So I want to ask each of you when it comes to how do you manage risk or evaluate risk in a deal? , particularly, you know, talk about this in my book, but how do we have a kind of method in there and how do we evaluate risk? But , how would you evaluate risk when it comes to deals?
Let’s start with Ryan on this and then we’ll kind of move around the room here.
Ryan Gibson: Yeah. Mine, mine’s very easy. Quality of the asset and that’s the physical quality in the market.
So the physical quality of the facility and then the market. And when I say market, I don’t, I look at rents per square foot. So in self storage, if you’re lower than $15 a square foot on a market, you are not a Class A market, no matter how shiny and perfect your building is.
So $15 a square foot annually is what I’m going to see. And that, anything below that is risky to me. , anything lower than an eight quality building, this is like a climate eyes, you know, typically a multi-story or, or recently built single story property.
I’m going to look for a market that’s growing two to 3% annually. And I want to see 70,000 people within a three mile trade area. Anything below that is not Class A to me.
That is Class B, CD, or whatever. Right. Then I’m going to look at how much leverage we’re putting on the investment.
Are we putting 80%, 90% leverage? , what is the DSCR on day one based on a T12 or trailing 12 financials. If that DSCR is based on the seller provided, not, not what you think it’s going to be, but the seller provided financials are lower than a 1.25. I’m going to start smelling some risk. And then I want to look at the leverage. And so I’m thinking anything levered over 65% starts to get risky for me. It just, it just does.
, you know, I want to see a day one DSCR of 1.35 in that Class A market. , and then I’m kind of feeling really good about it. The other thing I think is, you know, fixed rate debt versus floating rate debt.
That’s a big difference. , and then really, you know, it’s always about the, you know, the jockey, not the horse. I want to make sure that the person who’s operating the property or asset managing the facility, you know, no offense isn’t like a student pilot, like, you know, crash course last weekend and is doing their first one.
I want to make sure that, you know, the person who’s in charge of the operation is an industry veteran, not a, not a learned about this last year, , operator. So someone with, you know, a decade or more of experience and the quality of their experience, I think is really important to me. So I think it really boils down to asset market location , rents per square foot, how you’ve leveraged the asset and then the people that are actually behind the building, running and calling the shots is really kind of the risk to me.
And you know, I, and I think, you know, sometimes people might be a little critical about our projected returns and it’s like, well, the risk adjusted is really good. And I, I use that word risk adjusted quite a bit because you know, you buy a crappy building and a crappy market with an operator that doesn’t know what they’re doing, their returns might be out of this world, but the likeliness of them achieving those and the premi that they have to put on the inexperience and the quality, low quality asset, it, it could be, you know, you could be signing up for, you know, an equity loss pretty quick. So I think overall, I like to, I like to kind of look at the holistic picture.
Bronson Hill: Yeah, no, I think I like that. I like looking at the asset and lots of different things you shared. Let’s go to Kaaren.
How do you evaluate risk when it comes to deals that you look at personally or what even deals when people bring them to your group? And I know you don’t really, you know, validate deals or things like that. But like, what are some things you kind of just pay attention to?
Kaaren Hall: Yeah, we see a lot of things every day, as you can imagine. But so I think what I like to do is talk about some of the ways that we help other people mitigate risk. And one, when you’re dealing with somebody who is SCC, you know, tied to the SCC, they’ve, they’ve, they’ve got a syndication or maybe a large note or something like that.
And you want to vet them. I mean, so here’s a way to vet them. And what you do is talk to other people who’ve invested with them.
Obviously, you’re going to look at their docs and, and, and look at the, you know, the stats and the markets and so forth. But also go deep on the internet. We had somebody, you know, people do this.
She was going to make a half a million dollar note, and invest in real estate unsecured. It’s like, what is this? So we dug a little deeper and not only was she doing this, but she wasn’t even an accredited investor.
And then that was bad. And so are these assets, sponsors of people offering this note, are they even registered with the SEC? Guess what?
Not only were they not registered, but one of them had been incarcerated by the SEC for two years. So this woman did not do her due diligence. She did not go on Google and just say their names and the word fraud after.
I mean, just even the most basic due diligence, you think it’s too basic. It’s not another layer of that. , that’s a little more sophisticated is FINRA.
They have something called a broker check. Now I’ve used this because we had somebody who was trying to modify a note. They had a couple of investors with us.
And so what we’ve got some, one of my staff brought this note to me and they basically like wrote on the front of the note, like had to modern, not not a modification agreement, but they’re just going to like write on it with a crayon and say that they’re going to modify it. And I said, who is this guy? So I went to the broker check, looked up his name.
It’s just a rap sheet this long on him. And they’re somebody from the SEC from FINRA who had her email address there. And so I wrote her an email.
Just the thing was like eight years old. I thought maybe she still works there. Well, she did.
And she says, really, this guy’s still doing business. Are you kidding me? You know, let’s talk.
And so I got us a penis share docs and this, I mean, it’s a longer story for another day, but he was incarcerated as a result. I mean, we don’t get, that doesn’t happen every day, but, but you know, there are so many due diligence things that you have to look at when you’re investing. And that’s something that we really saw.
So you don’t always know if you’re getting into fraud, when you get into a syndication, you don’t know, there’s going to be a black swan, like a recession, like COVID. You don’t know that rates are going to go up and you’re going to have a, you know, a capital call on your IRA and have to come up suddenly with all that cash in your retirement account. These are unexpected surprises.
So you have to plan that in advance. And what do they say? Begin, Stephen Covey, remember him begin with the end in mind, you know, the seven habits.
So begin with the end in mind and understand that these things can go wrong. And an event like this can help you understand what could go wrong and try to plan for that.
Bronson Hill: Yeah, then everything that can go wrong at some point probably will go wrong. So it’s just having plans in place for that. It’s good.
Patrick, I know you’ve got some good things on this topic too. How do you analyze risk in a deal? Or how do you suggest people look at risk when it comes to deals?
Patrick Grimes: Well, it’s great being on the backs of Ryan and Karen because they do so much heavy lifting on several aspects and makes my my much more narrow. Maybe I’ll take a step back and say there’s portfolio risk. When you look at an investment, you have to look at your own portfolio.
Right. And what’s interesting about most of the population of America is a way over index in the stock market. They don’t have Ryan’s problem, right?
With being way over index and Alton looking to diversify their way over index in the stock market, which has a large amount of volatility. And I’ve ridden that wave. We’ve all ridden that wave.
Right. And so that is an amount of risk. You choose more stocks, regardless of how good that sponsor or that company is that you’re investing in more.
You’re over allocated in one correlated market. And so you got to look at first. I mean, what is the right next step for your allocation strategy to get not just financial security in one asset or financial independence in one asset, but true security, which is in non-correlation, right?
Not ones that are n’t driven by the same market fundamentals. I like to talk about that because you really have to step back and then it’s the what and with who right. And I think Kahneman in a great detail there.
I’m very validating who’s and I think we’ve all run across that before. I’ve tried to get involved in life settlement deals before where they had this beautiful deck and it showed all these great returns. And I was like, well, can I get your inventory of life settlements and I can compare all the ones that haven’t settled and they refused.
I was like, wait a minute, you’re only advertising the wins and you’re not showing I’ve been I’ve looked at I’ve looked at CPA firms so they wouldn’t a CPA firm wouldn’t provide transparency into their existing financials. I’m like, wait a minute, that doesn’t make any sense. Of course, those are not necessarily who knows if those are there just didn’t ask the right questions to make sure that the core value of transparency that we have as an organization is shared.
And if they’re not willing to share the information now when things are good, and they’re on their honeymoon, the sponsor of that organization is not going to be willing to share anything later when things are not going well. And so kind of that who and then it really comes down to like, where are you at in your life cycle? Are you looking for growth?
Are you looking for higher risk? Do you have time or are you looking for lower risk? Do you need cash flow and appreciation or tax advantages?
All of those things play into the what too. So and then the time horizon is something that’s really important and that risk profile. And that’s why now none of us, I don’t think our CPAs, attorneys or financial advisors, so we can’t give tax, financial or legal advice.
But that’s why every conversation we have comes down to where you are in your life right now. What are you looking for? What’s your allocation strategy?
And let’s talk about what’s the right next fit without actually giving financial advice, which is such a tough position for somebody to be in.
Bronson Hill: Right. Absolutely. We’re going to start taking some questions now.
So go ahead. And if you want to put some in the chat, I believe we have like nine questions from an anonymous person. So not sure who this is and we can’t get to all nine, but we’ll get to him, but put your questions in the chat and we’ll keep going there.
Actually, anonymous person, if you want to just write mine, write your name in there just so we know who you are too. It’s a little bit easier to answer when we know just a first name before you are, it’d be helpful. And then really three things I want to say real quick about risk from our own standpoint.
I started using chat GBT and uploading a presentation and just being based on my goals or what I’m trying to do. What are the risks here? And it will just come up with what are the questions I should ask.
And if you feel inexperienced, just like literally get some help with that, which it really saves so much time. Put PPMs in there, put docents like what happens in this center, ask questions like it’s right there for you and you just upload the docents. So helpful.
The second thing is I would really look and say, what do I feel? And this comes from my book, Fire Yourself. What do I feel is the biggest risk when I look at this because obviously there’s a way you’re going to make money, but what’s the primary way that you could lose money?
And I also try to ask that question to a sponsor. And a lot of the answers are very different from what I thought. Right.
So if I just simply, and I don’t tell them what I was going to say, I just say like, well, tell me, what do you think? And it’s like, almost always something different than what I thought. Right.
So I’ve been doing this for a while. Right. So again, just be willing to ask questions and a lot of that sponsor is going to be very familiar with the deal.
And then I like, I think one of you guys mentioned your background checks, broker checks, those kinds of things on their reputation. If you get references, that stuff’s super, super helpful as well. But there are so many different things that are, and there’s risks in stocks, right?
People have 20% loss in a stock or 50% and we don’t think, oh, I lost money, but it’s like, there’s risk in everything. Every investment has risk. And so that’s the thing, if you don’t want any, any risk by treasuries, even then there’s risk because of the debt.
So anyway, there’s risk in life.
Ryan Gibson: And always ask your spouse, ask your spouse. Because everything like if I would have just listened to my spouse on every investment, I probably wouldn’t have lost money and probably would have had a lot more money. So yeah, your spouses are very powerful in the, in the, in the process.
Bronson Hill: So it’s true. Yeah, there’s intuition. They may have an insight.
So we’re getting a few questions coming in here. Please do drop some in the chat here, either the Q&A or the chat, probably the Q&A would be a little bit easier. We can certainly chat as well.
But any insight on hotel assets, I want to just share, we have a guy in the audience as well named Mike Stoller, who’s here. He’s part of the wealth for, elite, our group. He is an expert in this, actually buying hotels locally and overseas even.
So Mike Stoller, Raul, if you reached out to him, does anybody have any insight around hotel assets that’s on our panel here?
Kaaren Hall: I just have something, you know, kind of small, but I mean, in a lot of markets, you can’t find an Airbnb because a lot of municipalities are disallowing them. And so what we’ve seen is an uptick in boutique hotels. And I believe that that’s what Mike specializes in.
So that’s what we’ve seen because of the downfall of Airbnb. It’s still out there, but it is more heavily restricted.
Ryan Gibson: I’ll say it.
Patrick Grimes: Well, Patrick, I’ve seen a lot of very favorable hotel deals. But I mean, as investors stay true to their principles, I have a very hard time investing in regions that are heavy in hospitality and investing in the hospitality industry directly because of its recession resilience. And I don’t, it tends to be the first to get hit.
And it takes a while for it to recover. Now recovery time does scare me away from the asset class. Go ahead, Ryan.
Ryan Gibson: No, I was going to say something similar, which is like high risk, high reward. I think you’re going to get a higher cap rate going in and you’re going to get the higher potential for cash flow. And I also think you’re going to have a higher, there’s a risk premi put on that higher cap rate because of the potential for instability.
And of course, this is going to be market dependent. I will say I think the millennials are falling out of love with Airbnb, which I think was exciting to me personally, but I just prefer brand loyalty now. And so I think hotels are here to stay and I think millennials are really chasing brand loyalty.
You see an uptick in revenues at the airline level and you see it at the hotel chain level as well. People like to have status and Airbnb doesn’t provide that. And so I’m more bullish on hotels than I’d say.
And in long term extended stay hotels, I think they are really impactful. So if you can find opportunities in that arena, I think that’s something worth looking for.
Patrick Grimes: Yeah, I’ll add to that. And there are certain markets like where you see resurgence and reshoring of manufacturing in the southeastern states where those extended stay hotels and those areas are booming right now, especially post COVID that does markets. It’s hard.
It’s going to be hard to lose and you’re not really at the hospitality of a vacation resort. This is more investing in a core manufacturing type market. So there’s always attractive investments in every asset cause I didn’t mean to bash it if anybody is really big on it.
Ryan Gibson: No. And you know what I think it’s interesting like self storage, you know, the tailwinds that we have are automation. Right.
And so, you know, I don’t know how many hotels you’ve stayed at recently or whatever, but you walk in and like it’s on the app now. You don’t have to talk to anybody. You know, there’s the decline in more towels and reducing, you know, some of the hospital, you know, the housekeeping.
Right. And I think that’s where it’s kind of a burden and labor costs. I think the hotels are really starting to dial that in.
And I think there could be some opportunities for that.
Bronson Hill: Eventually you’re going to have Tesla robots doing all the change in the bed sheet.
Patrick Grimes: Kind of doing it in hospitals. Why not in hotels?
Bronson Hill: They’re getting close to hospitality.
Kaaren Hall: Yeah.
Bronson Hill: Yeah. Amazon has more employees. It is more like a robot.
Have you seen the videos from their Louisiana facilities, like robots just like it looks like a Star Wars film or something. They’re just buzzing around all the different places and there are more robots in play than there are people now in the company. I think they’ve just passed more robots than people.
It’s pretty impressive. So which is also kind of scary because everything is automated. And what do you do?
So this is another reason to own assets. Right. Because you can’t automate.
You can automate, but you can’t own an asset. It gives you a lot of benefits. I guess a couple of questions here and we kind of talked about a lot of the stuff again.
I’m not seeing a lot of questions come in here, but I see one about dividends. Just somebody asking about dividends. I guess I have a question here.
How do you guys each evaluate, you know, either dividends or cash flow in a deal versus long term appreciation as an investor? Do you like to wait for cash flow at a higher level or are they both important? How would you weigh that out?
I guess it depends on everybody’s situation. But for somebody who, you know, in a situation that’s working a job, maybe they’re professional, maybe they make a hundred or two hundred thousand dollars a year. How would you kind of wait for those as far as importance, cash flow or appreciation?
Ryan Gibson: I think it’s all about your buckets of money. You know, Karen is going to be you direct IRA. Like, you know, if you got money in your long term, like Roth 401, you know, or 401k or traditional, whatever it is, I’m doing ground up development.
I’m doing some riskier things inside of my IRA because I can’t benefit from the cash flow as a forty one year old. So and then when I think about, you know, leveraging my other cash investments, you know, I might be more lenient towards putting that bucket of cash into an income producing asset. But either way, you know, I, you know, as a W-2 employee, I’m not trying to replace my income.
I think that’s kind of a fool’s errand. I think you can, you know, 50k at a time. Again, whatever’s left over in your 10 30 30 30 that last 30.
So like you’ve maxed out your 401k, you’ve maxed out your IRAs, you maxed out your 529s, you’ve done a lot of that sort of safe investing. And then now you’re over here and you’ve got that extra 30%. When I say safe, I mean, it could be safer to be in an alternative, but you can’t access that cash into the operator cell.
So I still go back to that fundamental, like that last 100k, try to do 100k a year into a syndication. I see a lot of our investors do that. And, you know, just know that, you know, hey, if it’s in your IRA, like maybe you can go a little riskier, right?
And because you don’t need the cash, you can do something more development, non cash flow. If it’s outside your IRA, maybe you do something more cash flow related that you can take advantage of the depreciation that comes from it, shield your taxable income because it, you know, usually that distribution is going to happen at ordinary rates. And you can use that depreciation to offset that.
So that’s kind of the way I think about it.
Bronson Hill: Yeah, I must have someone to add on that as far as cash flow versus depreciation.
Patrick Grimes: Well, I think it’s sort of what we were saying before. It’s like when it’s like, when are you in your life? When are you and what are your goals with, with where you’re at at that time?
And I think we’ve tried it in the income and acquisitions of private credit and the acquisitions, we’ve tried to give an option for distributions or growth, even for the cash flow component, right? Because the private credit is purely cashflow, you can reinvest it and compound monthly and actually turn it into a growth vehicle. And you can switch that back and forth.
Same thing with the acquisitions back that distribution can reinvest monthly to compound and grow, add more units, buy more units for that growth plate and make your growth grow even faster. And so there’s been that, I think it goes back to people looking for cash flow that is just coming from rents and they think, oh, well, look, I can get steady eddy rents. Well, we’ve seen how that could just disappear overnight, right?
And they want that rent versus, and then the pop at the end, you’re only looking for that tax advantage cash flow because they, they’re kind of, well, what happens is you run super, you run into this issue where you’re way over index in your cashflow position or your growth position of one asset. So other assets like legal funding, it doesn’t inherently have somebody paying rent, right? You have somebody that needs access to justice that can afford it.
So you pay the attorney. Now, that cashflow or that distribution, it comes in, it’s not steady eddy, right? It comes quarterly over years.
But what’s great about that is if you zoom out, you’ve got a solid distribution of cashflow over time that didn’t rise and fall with the rest of your portfolio. And I think that’s what people need to think about is how do you either fulfill the growth of the cashflow without getting over indexed, right, into specific markets, because those markets, those market fundamentals, can shift the entire tide of that whole allocation strategy in your portfolio.
Bronson Hill: That’s great. Hey, real quick. Before we, we’re going to have another minute for everybody to kind of chat here.
I just wanted to give a quick plug. We have a community we’ve created. It’s a private community.
It’s called the Wealth For Starter Pack. We have our Elite, which is a very high ticket thing, but we’ve set up something that’s basically free networking, education. People are sharing deals.
People are sharing. We actually have a couple courses in there that are valued over $1,000 each. So we decided to give this away for free.
And we have about 100 people in there right now. We’re having great conversations there. I just put it in the chat.
So if you’d like to join, there’s a QR code there on the screen. There’s also a link there. It’s bronze.net.com slash wealth. And you can go ahead and sign it for that. And we’re just super excited about what’s happening there. I just want to kind of give a quick plug for that.
And then I wanted to just go quickly around the room. I’m going to stop sharing this in just a second. And the link is in the chat there.
How can people reach out and follow each of you and what you’re doing just takes maybe 30, 60 seconds and just kind of wrap up with, , how people can connect with you. Let’s start with carne.
Kaaren Hall: Okay. That sounds great. Well, the way you can contact us and, and get a hold of us.
Well, we’re all over social media. So you know, follow us on Instagram. You can see that, , that, that, , Super Bowl tickets are real over there with 2 million hits.
But we’re also on, you know, Facebook, LinkedIn, everything, , you can reach out to us and, you know, and that’s on our website and, , grab the free report talks about alternative assets that go into self-directed IRAs and, , you know, contact us on the website. You can set up an appointment to talk to somebody to talk about what you are looking at investing in with a self-directed IRA? We want to hear about your deal.
You know, what are you investing in? Who are you investing with? Are we, do we hear a prohibited transaction?
We want to steer you clear , the things you can’t do, you know, in an IRA, which is committed, prohibited transaction. We haven’t even talked about that today. So, , we want to help you to be self direct , in the best way possible.
So hit us up and we’ll help you out.
Bronson Hill: Awesome. Thank you Karan. All right, Ryan, how can people connect with you?
Ryan Gibson: Yeah, I put my email in the chat Ryan at spartan hyphen investors.com. That’s our website. , and also tune in, iTunes, Stitcher, whatever it is, , I host a podcast called passive income pilots.
It’s the only podcast in the top 1% for airline pilots , who are looking to invest. So , we have a great show. It’s every, every week.
And, , we just talked about the big, beautiful tax bill actually last week on the show. And , we talk about everything. We talk about every type of investing.
It’s not just about storage. It’s very little to do with storage actually. , but yeah, you can hit me up on LinkedIn or check us out.
Awesome. Thanks brother.
Bronson Hill: Appreciate you being here, man. Awesome. Patrick.
Patrick Grimes: So it’s Patrick from passive investing mastery. You can look us up at passive investing mastery.com and we have three affiliate funds within that organization right there, private credit, commercial real estate acquisition, and then a diversified litigation portfolio. I also give away a free book at passive investing mastery.com slash book. I signed it. We sat them out or you could download the PDF copy ebook if you’d like, but I hope that tells, I tell my whole story of losing it all. And there’s a bunch of other chapters in there by some other actors, incredible people, athletes, even a rock star.
So happy to give that away. If you’re interested in what my favorite alternatives are Patrick’s favorite alternatives for investing for financial security, not just independence, any different. The most common question I get asked at the end of it is to invest with a con investor.
Bronson Hill: So I think we’re kind of losing a little bit, but I think we got you back.
Patrick Grimes: All right.
Bronson Hill: I’m excited.
Patrick Grimes: I’ll let you guys finish up.
Bronson Hill: All right. Thanks so much. I wanted to leave a little bit.
This just came to mind, but I’m all about anybody like any productivity hacks on just like a way to use chat, TBT, they can say a bunch of time. Anybody want to just I’ll give you a quick tip real quick. Okay.
This is not related to the topic at all. But if you take a video, for example, I like Rhonda Patrick stuff on health. I can take a two and a half hour video that she has.
I can take a link from it. Like a show like this, that we did this big, you know, part of this big interview, you can put into something called TurboScribe or some sort of transcription thing just with the link. You can take the transcript and you can put it all into chat, TBT and say, break this down for me.
You’re going to summarize, give me tips, give me quotes, give me based on this, based on that. And so there are all kinds of opportunities that will come up. So anyway, just wanted to say, I hope you guys, my dog’s eating the mic literally.
Okay.
Kaaren Hall: Grab the book, by the way, grab the book. Yeah.
Bronson Hill: Oh, the book. Yeah, exactly. But anyway, I appreciate you guys.
Thank you for being here. Thank you to our audience. Thanks everybody for being here.
I look forward to seeing you guys again soon. This replay will come out. Lots of love.
Blessings. Thanks guys. You’ve been listening to the mailbox money podcast.
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